Dmikras
Старожил
"On Jun 15th 2025 Government Officials reported the aircraft had a longer than normal takeoff run and used almost all of the 3505 meters/11499 feet"
Кроме того, не заметили кавычки когда я писал о последней плите?
Катастрофа самолета Boeing 787-8 авиакомпании Air India в Ахмадабаде 12.06.2025
"On Jun 15th 2025 Government Officials reported the aircraft had a longer than normal takeoff run and used almost all of the 3505 meters/11499 feet"
Кроме того, не заметили кавычки когда я писал о последней плите?
A.F.
take-off.ru
mishk , скажите пож., а где конкретно задний ящик на 787 находится? А то вон пишут сегодня, что не м.б. считан на месте из-за сильного повреждения пожаром и будут отправлять его в США. И какой тогда уже считали? (писали ж еще несколько дней назад cо ссылкой на пилота AI, наставником которого был КВС этого рейса, что кабинные переговоры все "достали", слышно хорошо)
Go-around
Местный
Да. Т.к. ссылки не нашел старой. Как подтверждение что было.#ау
mishk
Старожил
Задний в потолке ATT CREW REST , это чуть вперед от DOOR 4L . Передний в потолке около DOOR 1L. Картинку вот не нашел.....
Homyak
Новичок
Я вот думаю, может быть они прекрасно всё давно расшифровали у себя в Индии, но что-то вылезло такое неудобное, и они решили таким образом перестраховаться?
mishk
Старожил
LuKa64
Новичок
на 10 странице обсуждения инфа - скан с FR
и на 24 странице про место "последней плиты"
Air India 171 crashes shortly after take off from Ahmedabad | Flightradar24 Blog
Air India flight 171 from Ahmedabad to London crashed just moments after take off on 12 June. The aircraft lost height and impacted structures in a neighborhood to the west of the airport.
www.flightradar24.com
Последнее редактирование:
Dmikras
Старожил
После 80-ти узлов и до V1 взлет прекращается в случаях:
1. fire or fire warning
2. engine failure
3. the airplane is unsafe or unable to fly.
4. predictive windshear warning
По пунктам 1 и 4 совсем просто - сигнализация или есть или ее нет.
По п.2 тоже просто если помпаж, самовыключение. А если частичное снижение режима без индикации, которое экипаж возможно и не заметил?
Пункт 3 - довольно растяжимый, особенно когда счет на секунды идет.
Dmikras
Старожил
Не ниже 400 футов выполняются мемори айтемс, что касается двигателей - это ENGINE FIRE or Engine Severe Damage or Separation, Engine Limit or Surge or Stall. Мемори айтемс есть также для Dual Engine Failure - но на совсем малой высоте наверное уже не до мемори айтемс.
Если же просто самовыключение - то двигателем заниматься нужно уже после уборки механизации.
A.F.
take-off.ru
спасибо, mishk ! Я просто думал, он находится дальше в хвосте, который относительно сохранился, а получается, что фактически под основанием передней кромки киля, который оторвало и где всё разрушено и сгорело...
Не понял только по Вашим картинкам, а что это за две трубы-"дуги" в зоне расположения ящиков - какие-то усилители конструкции под них? Особенно с передним непонятно про них - где они расположены? Мне что-то пространственного воображения не хватает понять, в какой плоскости они находятся, будучи нарисованными так, через переднюю правую дверь...
Go-around
Местный
EEC должен распознать. На перемещение РУДов должна быть соответствующая реакция двигателя. Eicas msg и caution. Если вдруг это случится с одним двигателем и вилку не заметят.
mishk
Старожил
Это так шпангоуты схематично нарисовали, это я взял картинки из 3D locator, он по настоящему в районе передей левой двери, в потолке.
Большой Хорхе
Ордо Еретикус
А куда и зачем торопиться? Чтобы не было скучно в теме на форуме? По "горячим следам" немедленно выполняется проверка типа и, при отсутствии явных документальных (а проверяют-то именно их) оснований АП из разряда "что-то не так с типом вообще, нужно сажать борта" переводится в разряд "случилось что-то страшное". Ну и интерес АК не отменить.
Полагаю, считали ящики, явных косяков не углядели, поэтому далее расследование идёт уже в обычном дежурном режиме.
Чего гадать-то? До сих пор банального ответа кто был PF, а кто PM нет.
VirPil
Старожил
Это бы выглядело как резкий рост тангажа, чего не наблюдается. Да и места в багажных отсеков чтобы сидьно гулять нет, все забито.
Не пускают по IP?Регистраторов два, они дублируют друг друга. Один планируют отправить в США. Похоже, не торопятся с расследованием. Всю статью не могу прочитать, только анонс гугловский.
India to send black box of crashed Air India 787 aircraft to US for data recovery
The black box from the crashed Air India Boeing 787 will go to the US for analysis. The recorder faced heavy damage, making data extraction in India impossible. The National Safety Transport Board in Washington will extract the data. India's Aircraft Accident Investigation Bureau will receive...economictimes.indiatimes.com
India to send black box of crashed Air India 787 aircraft to US for data recovery
Air India Plane Crash: AI171 becomes the first ever Boeing 787 Dreamliner to crash
Air India plane crashed in Ahmedabad
India will send the black box of the crashed Air India Boeing 787 aircraft to the US for analysis. The recorder sustained heavy external damage from post-crash fire making it impossible to extract data in India, people aware of the development said.
They said that data from the Digital Flight Data Recorder (DFDR) will be extracted in the Washington-based laboratory of National Safety Transport Board (NTSB) and will be shared with India’s Aircraft Accident Investigation Bureau (AAIB) as under international rules, the state of occurrence has the responsibility of investigation.
“While AAIB had established a laboratory at its headquarters in Delhi last year, it is yet to be properly equipped to extract data from recorders which have sustained heavy damage. The NTSB team will carry them to their lab under protection and supervision from Indian officials to ensure that proper protocols are followed,” a person involved in the process said.
The United Kingdom’s Air Accidents Investigation Branch will also be present as there were 53 British citizens among those killed.
The Air India aircraft crashed seconds after taking off from Ahmedabad airport killing 242 on board the aircraft, and 33 on the ground.
image
The two units- the flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder (CVR) are called black box. Painted in bright orange, they are designed to survive extreme conditions and located near the tail as that area has the least impact during a crash. But heavy damages are common due to impact from the crash or from fire after that.
Data extracted from an aircraft’s black boxes is crucial in investigations of the crash as the flight data recorder will give insight into multiple technical parameters such as timing, altitude and airspeed. CVR holds crucial audio recordings from the cockpit, including pilot conversations and ambient noise like any warning message from the electronic systems in the cockpit.
The person quoted above said that the time to extract data from the recorder could range from two days to months depending on the extent of damage.
“Since the recorder has been damaged, the chip will need to be extracted by removing the memory board so that there is no further damage to data. The electronic circuit will also have to be assessed for damage,” the person said.
Investigators are examining multiple possibilities whether the flaps on its wings were properly extended and why the landing gear went down. They are also looking at electronic failure or a fuel contamination which could potentially lead to shut down of engines.
The 787, like any modern aircraft, has been built with multiple redundancy meaning there are duplications of critical components or systems to enhance reliability to make the aircraft fail safe. The aircraft has demonstrated capability to fly for 345 minutes with a single engine and with numerous system failures.
A single emergency Mayday call was the final radio message sent by the pilot. He didn’t respond back to the air traffic control, Samir Kumar Sinha, secretary of the civil aviation ministry, had said.
The AAIB, which is yet to form an investigators panel for the determining cause of the incident, has one month time to bring out the preliminary report.
( Originally published on Jun 18, 2025 )
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Air India Plane Crash: AI171 becomes the first ever Boeing 787 Dreamliner to crash
Air India plane crashed in Ahmedabad
India will send the black box of the crashed Air India Boeing 787 aircraft to the US for analysis. The recorder sustained heavy external damage from post-crash fire making it impossible to extract data in India, people aware of the development said.
They said that data from the Digital Flight Data Recorder (DFDR) will be extracted in the Washington-based laboratory of National Safety Transport Board (NTSB) and will be shared with India’s Aircraft Accident Investigation Bureau (AAIB) as under international rules, the state of occurrence has the responsibility of investigation.
“While AAIB had established a laboratory at its headquarters in Delhi last year, it is yet to be properly equipped to extract data from recorders which have sustained heavy damage. The NTSB team will carry them to their lab under protection and supervision from Indian officials to ensure that proper protocols are followed,” a person involved in the process said.
The United Kingdom’s Air Accidents Investigation Branch will also be present as there were 53 British citizens among those killed.
The Air India aircraft crashed seconds after taking off from Ahmedabad airport killing 242 on board the aircraft, and 33 on the ground.
image
The two units- the flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder (CVR) are called black box. Painted in bright orange, they are designed to survive extreme conditions and located near the tail as that area has the least impact during a crash. But heavy damages are common due to impact from the crash or from fire after that.
Data extracted from an aircraft’s black boxes is crucial in investigations of the crash as the flight data recorder will give insight into multiple technical parameters such as timing, altitude and airspeed. CVR holds crucial audio recordings from the cockpit, including pilot conversations and ambient noise like any warning message from the electronic systems in the cockpit.
The person quoted above said that the time to extract data from the recorder could range from two days to months depending on the extent of damage.
“Since the recorder has been damaged, the chip will need to be extracted by removing the memory board so that there is no further damage to data. The electronic circuit will also have to be assessed for damage,” the person said.
Investigators are examining multiple possibilities whether the flaps on its wings were properly extended and why the landing gear went down. They are also looking at electronic failure or a fuel contamination which could potentially lead to shut down of engines.
The 787, like any modern aircraft, has been built with multiple redundancy meaning there are duplications of critical components or systems to enhance reliability to make the aircraft fail safe. The aircraft has demonstrated capability to fly for 345 minutes with a single engine and with numerous system failures.
A single emergency Mayday call was the final radio message sent by the pilot. He didn’t respond back to the air traffic control, Samir Kumar Sinha, secretary of the civil aviation ministry, had said.
The AAIB, which is yet to form an investigators panel for the determining cause of the incident, has one month time to bring out the preliminary report.
( Originally published on Jun 18, 2025 )
View 1 Comments on this Story
(You can now subscribe to our Economic Times WhatsApp channel)
VirPil
Старожил
В том то и дело, что он не воткнулся. Спарашютировал без тяги.
mishk
Старожил
Может THRUST ASYM PROT? Msg Advisory
666wervolf
Местный
Реальнее поверить во внезапный нисходящий поток, как в официальной версии катастрофы Ту-154Б-2 в Алма-Ате в 1979 году. Но тогда 2 вопроса: RAT и Mayday...
Go-around
Местный
ENG control. ( проблема с тягой конкретного двигателя , не про вилку)
кофейник
Старожил
Air India 'Black Box' Damaged, Centre To Decide Whether To Send It Abroad
The black box of Air India's Boeing 787-8 Dreamliner plane that crashed on June 12 in Ahmedabad has sustained damage and may have to be sent to the United States to continue the data extraction process, sources have said.
www.ndtv.com